Hans-Christoph Steiner @eighthave@librem.one

@rene_mobile I understand why they were created, and I think the core idea is good. But the way it has been rolled out has been painful to a lot of developers, especially if the app isn't just doing a simple tie-in to a cloud service. My experience is that every other OS release introduced new and often conflicting APIs and requirements making it very difficult to make a UX that worked across the currently supported releases.

@spikebike @j2bryson @1br0wn That could play an role in the pricing, but I'm guessing it is a pretty small role. These exploits are generally sold priced per-target. The governments using them care about getting access to the target, not all the users of a platform.

That totally clicked for me, that's how I have been feeling about working with the Storage Access Framework APIs in Android. On top of that, Android APIs prefer cloud services. Guess what: #Google #cloud services are built-in defaults for those APIs on all the Google devices.

And that concludes my reporting on the #DMAWorkshop, thanks to the Filecoin Foundation for the Decentralized Web #FFDW and their grant to @guardianproject for paying my way. https://www.ffdweb.org/guardian-project-annoucement/ - https://f-droid.org/en/2022/02/05/decentralizing-distribution.html

Congrats to #matrix co-founder @matthew for rocking the last #DMAWorkshop, there was still quite a bit of buzz about how the live bridging demo carried a ton of weight, despite the lobbying efforts from #Meta, you can see it at around 14:00 in the live stream recording https://webcast.ec.europa.eu/dma-workshop-2023-02-27

@j2bryson @1br0wn given that #Android exploits are currently selling for more than #iOS exploits, I'd say that's one key piece of evidence pointing to Android as the more secure option https://www.zerodium.com/images/zerodium_prices_mobiles.png

Very exciting to hear the #EuropeanCommision say it is clear that the #gatekeepers are not the only ones who are providing secure and trustworthy app stores. I think that comment alone has made my trip worthwhile #DMAWorkshop

Rupprect Podszun said it is clear after today that there will be changes to the fee structures of app stores. #Google disagrees that there will be changes in the fee structure, and instead offers: "there will be more workshops". So is this a "kill the design by putting it to endless committee discussions"? #DMAWorkshop

Interesting comparison between #Google vs #Apple approaches at #DMAWorkshop. They have very different methods of gatekeeping, and #Android has been typically quite a lot more open #iOS. And Google has already added some improvements for other app stores. Google says, "hey, we're already trying to find ways to comply" while Apple seems to stick to its guns: "our way is the only way to trusted app stores."

The Open Web group is quite passionately advocating for putting web apps and #PWA on equal footing. While I do agree to some extent, I think there are key technical details that mean web apps will always be more dangerous for privacy and user control than native apps. Web apps are harder to review because their source can change per-user, per-visit, etc. #DMAWorkshop

@webmink @ilumium I hope I did your question justice. Perhaps not surprising, but there was pretty much a non-answer from the panel. #DMAWorkshop

App stores are certainly a lot more than just payment clearing services for selling apps. #DMAWorkshop

@webmink I haven't read the piece yet, do you have a question in mind?

@webmink @osi ask in the online chat, they've been taking a number of questions from there. Otherwise, I can give it a shot #DMAWorkshop

@ilumium finally got #FreeSoftware in the discussion: #Apple is not the only one who can run an app store well. And they didn't even invent app stores, but instead, that came from #GNULinux distros at least a decade earlier. #DMAWorkshop

#Apple's representative gave a classic, well polished FUD PR piece framed as lots of questions. Of course, I fully agree that human review of apps is key to trustworthy app stores, that's why #FDroid goes the whole way and requires apps provide the whole source code to be review, not just the binaries. And F-Droid does done this since 2010 even though #FDroid is not a #gatekeeper. Being the only app store on the platform locks out app stores that do better review than #apple. #DMAWorkshop