Joshua Crawford @jlcrawf@librem.one

@TheBradBlog
One of those two killed a violent criminal that was threatening more violence on other people.
The other one kills an innocent child completely incapable of defending itself.
Yeah, pretty sure the GOP has this one right.

@TheBradBlog
One of those two killed a violent criminal that was threatening more violence on other people.
The other one kills an innocent child completely incapable of defending itself.
Yeah, pretty sure the GOP has this one right.

@Leroy @troglodyt @malwaretech
At no point, during this entire thread have I ever defended the nazis. You said that you could explain how they aren't really socialists, yet you have failed to name a single difference between them.
Even in your last post where you are threatening physical violence against those with a different point of view, you are showing how closely aligned with nazis, you socialists really are.

@troglodyt @Leroy @malwaretech
thanks for playing.

@Leroy @troglodyt @malwaretech
As previously stated, "they lied" is not an explanation, if you do not show where the lie is.
"they developed a ruling class" is not an explanation because this always happens.
"they want peace between classes" you did not provide this argument, however, in this thread, you have both defended class warfare, then sayed that nazis don't want peace between classes, so I don't see how this sets them apart.

@Leroy @troglodyt @malwaretech
You have yet to name a single policy choice that sets them apart. You are the one that said "don't make me explain" how they are different. I took that to mean that an explanation existed. So far, the only explanations provided were, "they lied", "they developed a ruling class", and "they wanted peace between classes".

@Leroy @troglodyt @malwaretech
I am not the one that claimed that nazis wanted peace between classes, that was the argument given in this thread.
What you just descibed though sounds just like North Korea, Venezuala, China, and the old USSR. So again, hiw does this make the nazis any different?

@Leroy @troglodyt @malwaretech
That garbage aside, the only expalanation anyone has come up with for how nazis are not "real" socialists, is that nazis want peace between classes while socialists want class warfare.
If that is the only difference, that is not enough to convince me that they were not "real" socialists.

@kyle
Hopefully, you tell us how to do that in the book!

@troglodyt @Leroy @malwaretech
See, that is an example of what I am looking for. Differences between nazis and socialists.
Although, if I understood what you wrote correctly, it seems that you are trying to make the point that socialists are calling for class warfare, whereas nazis want peace between the classes.

@troglodyt @Leroy @malwaretech
In why we are socialist section, he explains why he ties nationalism to socialism. He does not believe that it would work without it. That does not disqualify him from being a socialist, nor does it imply that he is lying about socialism to gain followers.
Again, the simplest way to show that nazis were not socialist would be to lay out the tenets of socialism vs the tenets of nazism and show how nazism fails.

@Leroy @malwaretech
I am confused about how my using your exact argument with other groups makes me a bad actor.
Does this not show the fallacy in your argument?
The point was to show that saying somebody is a grift is not valid without presenting any evidence that they are indeed a grift.
In the case of this discussion, it would seem to be fairly simple to show where the ideology of nazism is different than the ideology of socialism. Something that you have yet to even attempt to do.

@Leroy @malwaretech
There is no question that the nazis consolidated their power, however, I am having difficulty coming up with an example of a socialist country that has not consolidated their power to a central government. Quite often with dictatorships. While this may not be the ideal socialist model, it is the most used socialist model and hardly enough to disqualify them from being considered socialist.

@Leroy @malwaretech
I could say that Black Lives Matter is a grift, because they clearly do not care about black lives.
I could say that Antifa is a grift because they are clearly a fascist organization.
But if I do not explain how that BLM does not care about black lives or if I do not explain how Antifa is fascist, it is merely me saying so.
In the same way, you saying that the nazis were using socialism as a grift is not an argument if you do not explain how they were not socialist.

@Leroy @malwaretech
Thank you. In our entire dialogue, this is the first actual argument for why nazis were not socialist. I am at work now, so, I will respond to the actual argument later, but I just wanted to thank you for trying to provide one rather than simply stick with "because I said so"

@mihamarkic @Leroy @malwaretech
Well, when one of you finally comes forth with an actual argument for why the National Socialists were not "real" socialists, maybe we can then discuss what about their ideology puts them on the right.

@Leroy @mihamarkic @malwaretech
No, they never havve been. The left simply wants to demonize the right, so the refer to them as nazis. However, the nazis ideology was closer to the left than to the right.

@Leroy @mihamarkic @malwaretech
In actuality, in the US, nazis are more often conflated with the right, probably for the very same reasons that you mention here.

@Leroy @malwaretech
Again, you saying it does not make it true. If the National Socialists were not "real" socialists, then it should be very simple to say, the tenets of socialism are ....., the nazis believed ......., they failed at socialism because ......
You have not done that. You keep saying that they are not socialists, but you have done absolutely nothing to expalin why.

@Leroy @malwaretech
This is not an explanation of how they were not socialist. This is you simply stating that they were not. I am still waiting for my explanation.